It's a great movie because it followed the check list to the very core. If you want to be next Meera Nair, Arundhathi Roy or Danny Boyle- Here is the check list for writing a great Booker's prize winning book or making an Oscar nominated Movie:
- All Indian Kids are beggars
- Hindu Muslim Riots is an everday thing; cruel Hindus murders Muslims in bulk
- All Indians lives in Slums (No luxury apartments please)
- If it's a story of a girl then she needs to be molested or raped
- If its a story of a Muslim kid, then Hindu rioter should murder his parents while a Hindu kid would carry Lord Rama's get up. (Of course in India when we Hindu go out for our ritual Muslim killings before evening brunches i.e. when we are not busy burning churches- we take kids in Lord Rama's get up)
- If some man would help the slum kids then it'll be only for making them blind and afterwards forcing them into beggary and/or prostitution (No NGO/ Social worker please!)
- India is full of filth, Indians doesnt have toilets, even Taj Mahal should be shown in reflection from gutter
- When a Brown Indian cab driver would start beating another brown Indian Muslim kid then it's only a western gora couple that would save him by offering dollars while kid would say "Welcome to real India".
- All Indians including a celebrity host (Big B, SRK or Anil Kapoor) would make fun of the kid's poverty as "Chaiwala" while he is live on a national TV channel
- Indian police would give third degree torcher to kid for any reason that of course includes answering every question on "Kaun Banega Crorepati"
- All the Indians who aren't working as beggars, prostitutes, tour guides, cab drivers, criminals, works in call centers. All call center employees speaks with a heavy Indian accent on phone (They don't go through any accent trainings)
- Indian railways doesn't have AC or 1st class compartments. In each compartment we have 1 million or more hairy, sweaty people in "fati baniyan"
29 comments:
Clever post dude...
Funny yet true!!!
Quite true, I was also thinking the same while watching it. Same thing happens with other countries in Hollywood i.e. French are always shown with Bread in their hands, Mexicans sitting on donkey. Stupid stereotyping.
All i will say its a clever story. As much we say that the "these cliched things are only shown", its very much true. we dont like it so we don't want to see it.. maybe thats the mentality for this sarcastical blog. Cinema is about showing an intersting story. If this story was displayed showing africa and its poverty in the backgroung maybe then indians wouldn't have written such kinda blog. How much truth was actually present in Blood Diamond? Do we know? Do we care to know? But most of us liked the movie because its good cinema. i think we need to get over the "indians shown like this will get an oscar" attitude while seeing a movie
The blog reaks of burnt patriotism, not for India, but for Hindustan.
India is what was formed in 1947 as a secular nation, was the unification of kingdoms, castes and religions. With that unity was a vow to accept all that bore of her womb. Which is what makes us a great democracy, unlike Pakistan.
The greatness of a society lies in its ability to look back at itself and see its shortcomings objectively, not just to preen itself. Take for example the US, they are aptly able to call Bush a moron and even cross the skin color barrier to elect a half-black President, to make things right.
It is unfortunate to see that many Indians, young, bright and educated Indians are not able to see the blatant shortcomings of our culture and our society (in India). Given that many, such as the blogger is unable to accept these obvious drawbacks, it is difficult to imagine them working towards changing anything.
I can understand "patriotism" blinding people, to not accept any criticisms of our WONDERFUL culture. However, it is a real pity to see that they cannot even let other people (in this case film directors) talk about such evil truths that haunt the progress of our culture. And by such blogs in fact, a sad closed-mindedness (in the pretext of patriotism) is revealed, which I hope does not disease others and the future generations.
-Krishna
@Krishna Similarly true story would be about a black kid,
1. Born in Jersy town (right in the back yard of NYC),
2. To a black hooker.
3. Then molested by a drug addict client of her mom...
4. Then he'd turn to religion where he would be sodomized by a catholic priest... etc etc
Do we hear about such stories?
No sir, we don't!
Typical right wing fundoo mentality?
India ke against bolne ka nahi ala Anu kapoor here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAAp2NRU7q8
Firstly, I haven't watched the movie yet and I am going by the blog content and comments. I am not arguing anything about the movie.
@Krishna
* In India vs Hindustan part by India you meant the "nation state"
* I agree with looking back but doing it objectively that too by a society is impossible according to me. US of A is not the perfect democracy (and there can be none). Measuring everything with USA is completely wrong. People have started peddling a lot of crap in the name of science, technology, modernity.
I *sincerely* believe Cinema that too feature films are not a medium for societal revolution, they do have a codependent existence with other parts of society. At best, measured in terms of efficacy in above terms, cinema can be a tool for propaganda (e.g. Russians). They are not portrayal of reality. Cinema is always story. The moment you enter your seat and the screen glows up you are told it is a lie, a made up story, a tale that is being told from few person's point of view.
So I do not take it as a uber-patriotism but a sarcastic take on hackneyed cinematic portrayal.
PS:No offense meant but 24X7 news hounds shouting at the top of their voice is also a (intended) portrayal of reality (objective one at that) but would that make a great cinema?
@Krishna and the like..
1. Did you ever walk the streets of Germany and suddenly get questioned by a stranger- Hey are you Indian? You say Yes. And the 2nd question hits you- Do you have cows walking all your streets? And you go.. umm.. err.. we do have them.. but then hey.. wait a second.. we dont just have cows walking all our streets!!
2. Did you have a foreign collaborator ask you amidst 30 other people in the most jovial fashion- Ah, so you guys are practically British, innit? Cos you learn English for sure?
Whatever happened to our own languages?
3. Or did you all of a sudden got left out with your French colleagues, cos hey, you don't know French. How dare you not know the language of the country you are visiting?
Just to make a point. There is a difference between realistic cinema and cinema that makes a mockery of you, cinema that stinks of ideas developed from tourists who would walk the streets of Varanasi or Allahabad but their shutterbugs work full swing only when they see thousands of people bathing in the same waters of Ganga and not the 5star hotels where they were putting up (reason being they have seen 5 start hotels before, not the former).. Cinema, that tries to show the real India, what it shows is a India seen by the eyes of the maker who was once sitting in his heated up drawing hall & heard some colleagues talk-- O my dear!! India is so crowded. Great people but let us say I would keep my distance. Great food, but it's too spicy for me. Great culture, but I didn't really get much of it.
Let's face it, we Indians are used to imitating the West, so conditioned "genetically may be" to appreciate anything and everything that's dished out to us on the "Hollywood" and "US" platter.
This doesn't mean I am endorsing overlooking our flaws and the tonnes of problems we have. This also doesn't mean, I will let you make a mockery of my plight.
US chooses a Black President. Applaud applaud!! Would you mind applauding when I say our constitution was written by a Dalit!!
Now sit in your drawing halls watching Kidman fight for creamies in Australia or walk the same streets as shown in Slumdog, you will yourself see a lot more to feel proud of.. now I wouldn't go into it. Will leave you guys to find it for yourself..perhaps when you can spare yourself some time from blogging!!!
@ Savita Bhabhi Lol mee too remembered the same "India ke against bolne ka nahi Sir" ala Anu kapoor
The post in terms of a provocation (also as a vent to an indignation)is a good idea but one needs to perhaps temper the polemic slightly...one cannot fail to agree that it is not depicting so many existing things about India which is the problem but that it really has to be a laundry list of more than a 100 cliches is problematic. Fiction should have coincidences but great fiction also requires a certain nuanced understanding of the society, which sadly Slumdog Millionaire for all the intelligence of its director does not completely provide. It depicts class conflicts in India, imagines democratization of knowledge through a show like KBCC, and shows a certain empathy with the lifeworlds and knowledge systems of the slum, and yet,fails to really problematize slum life in India as the process becomes somewhat like collecting and pasting together stereotypes -- everyday life in the slums is captured/punctured more by events rather than flow.One is left certainly with terrific entertainment but also acutely aware of a foreign gaze of a supposedly authentic India - content with retaining a sentiment of melos and picture postcard images of India...more so the universal pathos of a rags-to-riches story and boys-gets-the-girl itself could be the cultural-politics of the film
@kirti,, yes there exists movie much worse than you said in hollywood.. but you might not know ;-)
it's a shame that you didn't understand the movie.. firstly its trying to show begging 1990's when india for majority of people was in the same state as shown in the movie.. for all others who seem to be young.. pre-1991 India was like that!!
secondly this movie tries to capture our attention towards these things.. till day you will find loads of kids on delhi or mumbai streets begging.. have you ever tried to change their life!! have you ever asked their pains?? next time whenever you are travelling in sleeper class (and not in AC) then you should ask one of these beggars??
Now lets come to movie in general.. I appreciate this movie for the way the story is put forward.. and how beautifully things are executed.. that we all understood what it was trying to say.. sometimes bit harsh.. and some time too much bollywood (as in the end ;-) )
And for those who still thinks that they can come up with great script like this.. then why don't you sell these ideas to a writer :-) they will pay you a lot, but only condition it should be close to reality :-)
Many of the things in the list of cliches that you give about India didn’t feel cliched to me. The thing about cliche is not really the bare essence of it, which very often is true (i.e. cliches have a kernel of truth to them), but something is a cliche in the way it is portrayed. Love stories by themselves are not cliches - love happens often enough in the real world - but it is in the way you portray it that a love story looks cliched.
In fact, a clever way to exploit a cliche is to retain the basic essence of cliche but change everything around it. A love story by itself is cliched, but if you can set a lovestory between a coquettish slave owner’s daughter and a dashing scallawag in civil war US, it suddenly becomes “Gone with the Wind” and a classic.
Example relevant to Slumdog. When the kid jumps into a pile of excretum, it does not feel cliched because the movie is not trying to make a point about the necessity of clean toilets (which is true enough) but everything to do with his adoration of Bachchan. Context is everything.
I will agree that some elements feel introduced into the plot in a contrived way - Taj Mahal, call centers, and the Hindu Muslim riots. But I felt the movie had enough other good qualities - the kids, their humour, the background score etc. - to merit forgiveness.
Regards
Venu
I see exactly what you mean.. In a sense, I find the relentless depiction of negatives here as off-putting as any Madhur Bhandarkar movie.. And, of course, the love story doesn’t really work at all. I am sure it can’t work for any Indian who has seen so many movies based solely on a touching love story. So yes, I was disappointed too. But I still think I liked it more than you. It is certainly a well made movie that is quite entertaining. Just not as great as it is being called. Not even close to that actually.
It’s funny: I told a friend that there is a difference between clever and great cinema.
Slumdog is clever cinema for sure–smartly acted; brilliantly photographed with a clever plot twist of using the the t.v programmer as a plot prop.
But it is not great cinema as it is being portrayed by many–mainly in the Western media. For me the give way was this: A Muslim kid–you would see him lose his family to riots, right? I mean what could be more natural! Then the usual others things follow: The creepy slumgod who offers a Coke to the little kid and you can tell immediately that he is the bad guy who is going to inflict untold horrors on the innocent ones. Or the bumbling Western tourists who had no idea about Taj Mahal and would be fooled by a 10 year old and another set would rescue a little kid being beaten up by the ”bad” driver. I mean, how natural?
I find such cinema distasteful not because it portrays ”reality” but exploits it for it cinematic purposes–whether prizes or footfalls.
Obviously you read many reviews and feedback articles on the movie (especially in the western media) before you went to watch it.
I don’t disagree with you when you say its not a great movie. But i wont call it a disappointment. Far from it. It was an enjoyable movie, very entertaining and as you say cleverly made. I think what you are disappointed about is the kind of response this movie got in western media.
Don’t blame Mr Boyle for taking liberty of making all those things happen to a single individual, its his job! Blame the western media for calling it “real”.
Another point I want to correct you on, “something greater, as Oscar winners ought to”. Oscars are the biggest celebration of “Masala” in my opinion not of any cinematic greatness.
I’ll tell you a movie that was a disappointment to me GHAJINI. What a pain to sit through it.
At one of the comments about the Indian Constitution being written by a dalit etc...i think from Meet
1. USA is not perfect. That states but the obvious. Nothing can be. But it is a decent example of a "progressive" society.
2. Applaud Applaud Indeed for the coming of a black president to the most powerful white nation, in our lifetime. Mind you this is no small feat for a society.
AND This does not in anyway really compare to the indian constitution being written by a Dalit.
The choosing of black P represents a step by the maority of that society. Dalit writing our constitution did not require a majority consensus of the Indian society to think and ponder of this issue.
India has had a woman PM, US has not. Does that mean anything at all. This says something remarkable.
However, if a woman gets elected P to USA it will be a big deal, because it tests the soul of that society asking it to choose and reconsider the status of a woman in their society.
Unfortunately, India has not gone through those social and moral struggles that, for example, the US or some of our western counterparts have gone through. VOTING for women, meant something for the women of the US. WOmen in India can vote, but they got this on a silver platter, courtesy of movements and struggles in the west.
PS - all the comments about collaborators asking you about cows... bla bla bla...That should be embarassing for them not you, unless you know that some of it .. is true!
it shows THEIR lack of knowledge, not that they saw Boyle's movie. ALso, in reality, try to find out how many westerners actually get around to seeing such movies (mostly indians see them, crib about them... and crib some more).
Secondly, INDIA is not delhi, bombay.. and the 2 cities per state.. that we know. It is farmers, it is poor people for whom MK Gandhi stopped wearing half his clothes, it is still the mistreatment of lower castes, it is still dowry dealings, it is still the selling of kids and kidneys.
SO MAYBE, what some of these movies do is ask you to take at look at an India that we don't know, and maybe don't want to know. And try to change it in any best way possible.
-Krishna
oh oh... and one more thing..i agree...GHANJINI sucked... They should ban it... it is such an incredible waste of time.
@Meet again, sorry but Im on a role now....
I am very proud of the good things of the Indian society and culture. But I am not ashamed to admit that there are many many shortcomings as well. Having said this openly leaves me unafraid of any image the west would like to paint, for I am aware of the reality and find it useless to battle images.
The good things in our culture CANNOT overshadow that bad things. So I think its time that Indians just get over it and stop cribbing when people ask about cows (coz guess what, they used to roam about the streets of Bombay till a few years back!). And why are we so defensive about when people ask such questions... coz we know its true. We see the malls and 5 star hotels coz it makes us feel better... but what kind of a country lets majority of its citizens be illiterate, while making 5star hotels and malls....that is what the West sees. Its time we start battling reality, instead of wasting time with battling what the west "thinks" of us! Which can only happen when we OPEN our eyes, see our faults, face up to them and stop whining when foreigners say things.
@ Krishna
The so called appreciating class must b full of arundhati roy and ilks….otherwise its a maha bakwaas movie…i had the similar thoughts abt booker prize winner white tiger….
@ Abhinav
The movie is an adaptation of Vikas Swaroop’s ‘Q&A’. I haven’t read the book. If Daniel Boyle has stuck to the story then I don’t think your review is justified.
Child prostitution, forced begging and blindings of innocent children are part of the same criminal circle. If you have seen movies like ‘Salaam Bombay’ you may notice this is the kind of organized crime that exists in Mumbai and elsewhere.
You failed to notice how a foreign director has been able to capture the back alleys of Mumbai and Agra effectively, the hysteria a game show like ‘KBC’ creates.
@ Krishna
I’ve actually worked on development projects in urban slums. I find films that show the lives of poor as unrelentingly dismal and full of horrors very dishonest, ill-informed and sleazy.
To call a spade a spade, these films are basically voyeuristic in nature because the filmmaker is usually middle class or upper middle class and the audience is equally privileged.
Since the poor aren’t the ones wielding the cameras, they aren’t the ones telling their stories. Thus there is no way to tell the veracity of these accounts and all that happens is that we are wowed by the technical finesse and the gritty, raw edginess of it all (especially a certain kind of hipster audiences in the US who love these sort of films).
It’s the same thing with literature. First, there is the fictional license. And then, your readership, especially if you are writing in English is overwhelmingly privileged. They do not live these lives and will mostly swallow whatever you tell them.
Which is how folks like Vikas Swarup (an Indian Foreign Service officer - that’s as privileged bureaucrat as you can get) and Aravind Adiga (Columbia and Oxford educated) get the accolades they do.
Suketu Mehta did something similar in Maximum City but made the mistake of bullshitting about Vinod Chopra. And Chopra’s too much of a livewire to let that pass.
I will never forget a discussion that I had with a woman in one of the slums I worked at, a whip smart person who spoke her mind. She asked me “Aap log hum gharibon se itni nafrat kyon karte ho”?
Honestly, every time I see an ostensibly bleeding heart film like this, her words always ring in my head. Someday, hopefully, our poor would have the resources and opportunities to tell their stories, and we would be able to get rid of the intermediaries who are supposedly speaking on their behalf.
@Krishna
Some of the negativity depicted was shown as “thing of past”. Many ves were also shown when Jamal returned to “mumbai”, such as rising buildings, call centers, millionaire show, an honest policeman (irfaan khan) :).
Movie was definitely better than any crap produced in bollywood or any where else with Indian context. The ending song and dance made me like the movie ;).
I liked the movie for the only reason that makes you feel otherwise.
All the mainstream Indian cinema is busy showing an India where the characters go on vacation in Goa in BMW, go to USA/UK/Mauritius after a heart break, hangout at pubs, wear designer clothes etc etc… I do not question that there is a portion of India that is doing all this but then there are millions other like me whom I meet in everyday life who go through dirt and filth of India.
And amazingly there is no mention of us in popular cinema. I no doubt understand that it is the audience that choses the kind movie that is made…So it takes outsider who has a lesser concern for pulling the money out of our aunties who can not look beyond an international locale and embroidery on the dress worn by the leading lady, to show the filth he has.
While our film makers are constantly copying west, a westerner has shown that an entertaining film can be made in India, with Indian characters, Indian scenes (filthy or otherwise)… Hope the rajshris/yashrajs/vermas et all stop throwing such trash on me than they always do…
As you are against the depiction of the India that this movie has, I welcome something totally different from what I always have to endure.
@Thalsa.
I too have worked with some children and met their families in the slums. And of course these films are not even trying to capture the "good things", but thats the point... they are not trying to. When did DB say this is REALITY. Then you might as well have taken real footage and shown it on Discovery channel or something.
However, these people make a point not about the good things, but abotu the Bad things. And either we can reject them as fictional and non existing... or venture out to search for them. I have seen the marks of beatings on our domestic helpers, they would meekly mention who gave them these marks only after you ask them twice. And children put to labor even though education would be free for them. I KNOW people who have aborted the girl child...now if dowry and money was not such a big issue, why is this happening?
While I have absolute faith in the fiber of humanity (read Shantaram, he writes about it wonderfully), I will not say that the lives in the slum are havens of happiness. The poor like the rest of are full of life, love and pride. When we work with them they wouldn't crib about their life half as much as we do.
But again, the strength of a chain is judged by its weakest link, not its strongest. Hence we will be measured by the lowpoints of our society not the high points. And of course nor movies, nor our limited understanding can capture the entirety of lives of the slum dwellers, but they can only show one aspect at a time. And thats what these movies are doing... some show the good parts, show show the bad. (Its like saying Astitva is a crap movie.. because there are so many happy couples, and guys who wouldn't do that.... )
And as far as the "reality" based depiction of the movie goes.. you wouldn't hear us talkign like this about Lagan.. (c'mon villagers winning a cricket match against the british!?) how real is that... but we love it.. coz its not "against" india is it now?
AND @ meet again... We feel bad when they talk about our beggars and poor conditions and ask them to see 5 star hotels. When they see the 5 star hotels and the high-class Indians.. who speak english and drink tea, we crib when they call us half-british. I mean, honestly, we have to take a call and what our problem really is.. is it what the world thinks of Indians... or are we really suffering from a pathetic identity crisis.
well.. Slumdog already won all 4 nominations at Golden Globe :-)
And it is on its way for academy.. people in west are crediting this movie for direction, for background score.. nobody is judging India the way some people did here.. The slums shown in the movie is the time in 1990's. We all agree India has changed!!
@Meet: I am sorry for you, but calling us british.. who does it?? and talking about french.. well they behave in same way with german, american or whoever.. why pointing it out here??
just watched it... what a travesty they made of a fantastic book...... why did they chnage his name an religion and his whole nature...... he was not aa muslim.... his name was not Jamal but Ram Muhammad Thomas... Salim was his friend.... younger than him and he cared for him would have laid down his life... the blinding of him never happened.... I actaully did not recognise what I saw.... I thought it was what he was covered in when he met Bachachan lol lol lol !!!!!
The depiction of slums is not the issue here and we Indians most humbly accept our shortcoming ,infact I enjoyed the movie as a form of creative art ,but the problem starts with the stereotyping of the class conflict .....see anil kapoor taunting jamal on his slum back ground and him being a chai wala and more over the audience guffawing in that ugly way in response....wait a minute ..,can you imagine amitabh bacchan letting go such a volley of abuses .Anil does it not in a typical direct way but in a way which says much more than it appears to naked eyes .I dont think that was in good taste ..that brings out the primitive western instincts ,as the saviors of moral uprightness .a colonial hangover that never lets go..and the stereotyping of indians and more so as the inhabitants of the subcontinent .We dont disagree with the fact that there is class conflict ,but it exists in every civilisation to a certain extent ,thankfully our constitution strictly prohibits such discrimination on a public medium like tevision.We own up to our poverty ,our poor health services ,our corruption ,our politics.. we are trying to improve things and are increasingly successfull.To sum it up I would quote the director of "Dharavi " who talks about this BBC documentary being filmed during the course of of filming Dharavi .He was requested to help the BBC crew around dharavi .He says during a shot inside a hut one of the BBC crew comes screaming "stop.....theres a telivision set inside"....A telivision set is out of place in a slum ........! Somebody said journalism? Infact journalism with a script...This hasnt stopped us getting this far.... we have a long way to go and we assure the west , we will be there ....where no BBC ,danny boyle script can think of ....in no time... !till than ride Tatas jaguar and Rovers ....our day will be when we see these in our countryside ..the common man being able to afford them.. Jai Hind.
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